Sharp Business Growth w/ Deacon Bradley

Deacon Bradley: We're gonna do
things a little bit different

today.
Hello, and welcome to the sharp

business growth podcast, the
show for CEOs who want to create

healthy business growth. I'm
your host, Deacon Bradley,

alongside justice Murray today.
And on today's show, we are

doing things casually, we got a
conversation that I want to

share with you, justice and I,
we sat down to record, we've

talked for over an hour before
we hit record today. And one of

the things that we talked a lot
about was, each of us worked

with a lot of CEOs who are
growing their business, we see a

lot of the same problems. And
one of the things that comes up

over and over is that need for
an integrator and the business

visionaries and integrators
worked so well together. If you

want to know more about that
read the book rocket fuel, it's

fantastic. And that is a very
powerful combination. But what

visionaries often are missing is
they don't understand an

integrator they don't understand
how an integrator wants to be

approached, they don't
understand what to expect. And

as a result, they wind up being
a little bit stuck. And so

today, Justice is going to pick
my brain. I'm an integrator, and

he is just asking me a whole
bunch of questions because you,

the CEO, the visionary, we want
you to understand integrators.

JUSTUS MURIMI: Okay. So whenever
when I think about this episode,

I think it's really important
for if CEOs and visionaries are

listening to this, I assume a
lot of them are going, Okay,

everything you guys are talking
about, I'm at that place, I need

an integrator, I need somebody
to come in. And I would assume

what they think attracts people
like you is might be different

than what actually attracts you.
So when you're looking at a

business going, I can help here
or I'm attracted to this. What

what are you looking for? Or
what attracted you to businesses

where you did come and help?
What did you see that was like,

or I'd like to come in here and
help this thing scale? Huh? Well,

Deacon Bradley: I guess I would
summarize it under the word

opportunity. But then I put an
asterisk next to that, because I

know if you're listening to this
podcast, you're going, Hey, I

got a great opportunity right
here. What I think justice is

getting at is we're in involved
in a group that has a lot of

visionary CEOs. And I was
telling him the other day, I was

like, Man, it's so interesting,
the sheer volume of visionary

CEOs in this group. And when you
talk about an integrator,

they're like, great. I'd love to
pick one of those up, but the

integrator store, are you an
integrator, let's hang out. And

I'm doing that thing sometimes,
where as they're talking, I'm

like, shrinking down in my
chair, like, hoping they don't

notice me, right? Cuz I don't
want to work with them. And I

think that might be what you're
getting is like, some of them

are. Yeah, so I'm in a short,
I'm interested in opportunity.

But I'm also as an integrator, I
think I'm really highly aware of

where I'm strong and where I'm
weak. And so I'm looking for

like a specific scenario, where
it's like, oh, you need a tennis

partner who can crush backhands?
Yeah, gosh, I can hit back hands

all day. My forehand is
terrible. Oh, you got four

hands? Hey, let's play, huh? I
know, that's not how tennis

works. But you get it?

JUSTUS MURIMI: What were you
Okay, this is so helpful. What

makes you shrink, always make
you shrink wrap back in that

group, like, what were you
hearing, you're like, that's not

what I want to hear.

Deacon Bradley: I was I'm
reading between the lines as

they're talking. And they're
kind of sharing, like, I got

this opportunity and that
opportunity and this other

opportunity, and it's justice,
it's gonna be huge.

Unknown: And in my head, it's
like,

Deacon Bradley: I'm, I'm hearing
this liability and that

liability. And Deacon, you're
gonna fix it. I'm not so like,

what's missing, I guess, is a
really clear vision about

everything. It's not. So I think
the misunderstood part is, on

one hand, we and you're really
good at teaching CEOs to do

this. You need to have a clear
vision. So you need to spend

we've talked about this some on
the show already. You need to

spend more time in your vision,
pulling it together, like making

it like just crafting your
vision. That's part of your role

as the CEO. And then but there's
this other part where it's like

if that if that's not clear
enough, and like I don't

necessarily, I don't think
integrators necessarily want to

hang out. Because

JUSTUS MURIMI: it's just chaos.
What what I am like about to go

you Like you're preaching to me
right now I'm like, Yes, yes,

yes, I know that this is so much
value. When do you know that the

vision is clear? Like what are
you hearing that like? And maybe

what are you picking up on that
maybe other people might not

pick up on in the video Like, I
could fit in here. I'm excited

about this.

Deacon Bradley: One of the
things is just how just to steal

Cameron Harold's name for it
because I can see his book over

there my bookshelf that you
recommended I read justice, good

book. vivid, is it vivid? Like,
can I step into it and see

exactly what it's supposed to
look like when it's done. That's

really important, because an
integrators job is to bring that

to life. So if your vision is
just money, or it's gonna be

huge, I don't know if if it's
going to be huge is like I'm

working 60 hour workweeks and
flying all over the country, and

I'm on like, TV shows Hawk in
this thing, or if it's gonna be

huge, like we've built this
incredible team, we're so

focused, that we only work on
one or two things, and it's

great. So I think the, the thing
that I, I noticed in the vision

is like, is it vivid? And then a
really another thing that I look

for just as kind of like a test
for if it's something I can do

or not, is, is it focused? I
don't know if that makes sense.

Yeah, this is a big one. Yeah.

JUSTUS MURIMI: Yeah. What do you
When do you know that it's

focused? Like, give me the, give
me the like, the, the symptoms

of a focused vision? Like,
that's a terrible word. But do

you know what I mean? signs?
What are the signs of a focus

vision? Not

Deacon Bradley: the symptoms,
geez, the size of a focused

vision is like, well, it's
really clear, I guess, you know,

focus kinda. It's a good word,
to create clear clarity. So it's

really clear. But also, it's not
like, it's like a, it's not like

a shotgun. It's like a rifle.
Like, there, I am aiming this

this point on the horizon, and
we're going there. It's not

like, We're going west. And I
don't know if we're gonna wind

up in Mexico or Canada, but
they're both West. So it's more

focused around. What we're what
we're trying to create an

example. This is, is I think, I
don't remember if you were in

this meeting, or if we just
talked right after but a CEO

that that you and I have worked
with a lot. And he's laying out

the vision for one of the
businesses. And I, after I left,

I was like, Man, that was
fantastic. Because I know where

we're supposed to be in a year.
Yep. The opportunity is really

clear. I see the upside. Yep.
But but it was clear enough and

focused enough that I knew what
it should be in three months.

And because I could see that
clearly, I knew what it should

be in two months and one month,
who needed to be on the team,

what you could cut and throw off
the ship to go faster. Like I

could see all of that because of
the clarity. And because of the

focus. It wasn't just like a,
like, anything that makes money

or is nearby. I'm going to scoop
it up. And we're going to do

that too. Because, hey, I've got
an integrator they can do those

things.

JUSTUS MURIMI: It would it be
safe to say, I'm here to help

you get where you want to go not
fix the problems that you have.

Deacon Bradley: Hmm, well, I
think they're both true, because

I will help you get where you
want to go. I will also fix the

problems that you have. But what
I won't do is fix your broken

unfocused vision. Because it's
just it's not

JUSTUS MURIMI: so good. Is it?
This is going to help so many

visionaries. I hope. One of the
things because I was in that

group call with you was that
there was an over communication,

their vision was of not having
problems. It was not of where

they wanted to go. It was Oh,
that's a good point. It was

here's all these things, I need
an integrator, here's all these

things that are going wrong. I
really need an integrator, like

they would help me solve these
problems. While an integrator is

going that's not an opportunity.
Yes. That's an that's an author

job. Yes. All that's good. You
don't want a job?

Deacon Bradley: No. What do you
want? Well, gosh, that's a big

question. You and I have worked
a lot on purpose. So I was

actually I had this exact
conversation with the CEO

earlier today. And we were
joking that he's like, Yeah, but

guys like you are unemployable.
And I told them well, you know,

the last business that I was a
partner of for four years, found

a way to employ me. So you never
know. And so we were talking

about what that was. And I was
like, Look, what do I, what do I

want? I figured out my purpose,
what is my gift to the world,

what I'm really good at. And
what I want is to spend 80% of

my time doing just that, and not
not spending my time outside of

that purpose. So Gosh, I got a
little Boston and no one Asian

land there.

JUSTUS MURIMI: But they're
picking up on on what you're

saying. Because I am, I am kind
of integrator ish, but a much

more vision way more. It I
thought I was more of an

integrator until I met a true
integrator. And I was like,

that's not. And then I met a
true visionary. And I was like,

I'm less of that than I thought
I was. But I'm somewhere in the

middle. But what I'm hearing you
say is, if you're a true if

you're a good visionary, and you
want an integrator, their

vision, the integrators vision,
your vision has to help them

accomplish what they're owed.
The integrators vision, the

integrators purpose.

Deacon Bradley: Yeah, they have
to, they have to line up. So a,

a partnership that I've been
kind of, I guess, inching

towards and working with for a
few months now, has been exactly

like that. And the last
partnership I was in before,

this was exactly like that,
where they showed up, and

they're like, here's my vision,
here's what I want to build. And

I'm like, okay, like, that's
clear enough that I'm

interested. And then my response
was, here's my personal vision

and my personal mission and what
I want my life to look like and

what I want to build, and there,
and then we're kind of like

looking at both of these things.
Again, we're on this, like, the

same side of the desk,
metaphorically speaking, like

looking at these things is like,
do these could these fit

together? And if they did this,
like it did in my last

partnership, and we had an
amazing partnership for for four

years. And this new one that I'm
working on, it looks like

there's a really good fit. There
were my personal vision of when

I use vision and integrate a lot
in the sentence. Yeah, my

personal vision of what I want
my life and my business and

everything to look like, as an
integrator blends up really well

with this visionaries vision.
It's like, Oh, okay. I yeah.

Let's take the next step and see
what that could look like.

JUSTUS MURIMI: I love that.
Okay, so I feel like we were

giving them enough like, if the
visionary is listening to this

right now, they're like, Oh, my
gosh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

Yes, I can. I get it, I get it,
I need to go work on my vision,

I need to start having more
conversations about this. for

you as an integrator, what are
what have you noticed people

think will attract you, which is
not as high on the list for you,

when it comes to working
alongside them?

Deacon Bradley: You know, a lot
of times they don't think

anything attracts me, they don't
think about it at all. They

think I am running this
business, and I'm just gonna go

get people to get on my bus. So
I'm just gonna, like, drive up

to the integrator bus stop,
opened my doors and holler out

who wants to get on this bus?
And we're all standing around,

like, looking at each other like
nobody? I don't know, where's it

going? I don't even know where
the bus is going.

JUSTUS MURIMI: Do you like part
of what I think some of them?

This is what is surprising
What's surprising to me until I

look back at some of the
opportunities that I went after?

Is I've picked up from you a
little bit like, you definitely

want to make money, but it isn't
the number one thing you're

looking at first.

Unknown: Right? Like,

JUSTUS MURIMI: I've noticed, you
are a lot of visionaries. You're

like I can't pay someone like
you. And a good integrator is

almost like a good copywriter.
And they're like, I'll take a

percentage of revenue, because I
believe my skill set with this

thing that I'm building is so
good. And yes, you will also pay

me. But I feel like a lot of
really, really good integrators

have such a good eye for
opportunity, and are confident

in their skill set and the
opportunity that they're like,

let's talk about other ways we
can make this thing a reality. I

Deacon Bradley: totally agree.
Totally agree. Like if I was out

there looking for jlb as an
integrator, and I just put out

my salary for what I'm worth
just based on past history of

growing businesses. Like I don't
think anyone would hire me

because it's a lot. Yeah. Right.
And I know that that's not how I

would make that money also. And
it's and frankly, it's not that

fun or motivating to an
integrator because I integrators

are motivated by the growth. And
so if you're gonna pay him flat

rate, and expect them to do
their magic, it's like it's

boring. Frankly, I would rather
come into a business making zero

or insultingly low salary. Yep,
with an opportunity to grow it.

And one thing we didn't talk
about, but here's something that

I absolutely look for, not
explicitly, but it's, it's

pretty clear when you're talking
to somebody, and that this

visionary is willing to give me
authority to grow it, then I

feel like, Okay, I have the
skill set, the opportunity works

out, and they are going to
actually allow me to do what I'm

good at. Yeah. So I believe that
I'm going to make more through

this partnership and have more
fun through the partnership than

I would just getting some
salaried job.

JUSTUS MURIMI: Do you this, this
is huge. What is a way that you

like to you like to be
approached, when it comes to an

opportunity? Here's what I think
when I know from visionaries,

you're like, I don't have the
money for you. But I think, but

I think we could work really
well together. I am embarrassed

of the mess I've created in my
business. And if you look at it,

you're gonna make fun of me or
think that I'm, I suck. I'm

already insecure about this. And
then the other fears like, Oh,

great, you come in, then who am
I like, they get insecure about

like, great, you come in you
lead, you're such a strong

leader. Like, and you demand so
much authority, or like, you

don't demand it, but you you,
you're gifted and so other

employees will go, we're gonna
report to you, you're finally

given us clear direction on what
to do and all this other stuff,

that the visionaries then like,
well, like, what's my job here?

And so can you speak to those
things?

Deacon Bradley: Yeah. So I guess
as far as that one of the first

things you said, it reminded me
of a conversation I had this

week, like, how do I like to be
approached? a CEO approached me

earlier this week, or last week,
we got on the phone earlier this

week, and I didn't even know
what we were going to talk

about. But what kind of what
kind of worked out? Was he? He's

like, yeah, you know, I just
actually heard that you weren't

working at this other
partnership anymore. Like, Can

Can I just want to talk? I don't
even I'm not asking for anything

specific. I just know that I'm
not good at what you're good at.

And so we just, he just kind of
opened up. His vision was like,

here's what I'm building. Here's
where I am. Here's what the team

looks like, what I don't know
what what do you think so. But

he get the way that he
approached me, which I think is

a good way was, was humbly
asking for insight. What do I

not see is essentially what he
was saying, Do you see something

that I'm missing? Can you help
me avoid a mistake? Or just

point me to the right direction?
I don't know. And I think that's

a really good way to approach an
integrator with emphasis on the

humility or, yeah, because Yeah,
because like you're asking for,

for insight into a very personal
private business that you have

built, which, as you mentioned,
can be a little bit like there

can be some anxiety there. But
as an integrator, I'm not afraid

of what I see. In fact, the
Messier the better. Yeah, well,

but the part that I am afraid of
is if you don't have humility,

then I don't believe you're
going to give me the authority

to actually do what I need to
do. Yep. So I don't really care

so much about the mess. But I
care about your mindset around

fixing the mess and and you're
like, how tight of a grip do you

have on the way things are done?

JUSTUS MURIMI: That's a big
deal. How do you know that a

visionary is ready for you?

Deacon Bradley: How do I know
that a visionary is ready for

me. They have a clear vision, we
mentioned that I can see exactly

where they're trying to get to.
I can picture I guess in my

mind, I'm like, I can see the
next three to 10 steps in my

head just from talking to him
about the vision. That's like

one component. And then the
other component is if I'm

sharing with them the steps that
I see and how I might approach

this some some obstacles we'll
probably have to navigate or

whatnot. If I find it
particularly like I often like

to, to test visionaries a little
bit around like around how

strong of a grip Do they have on
the way things are done? And I

might suggest something that is
different.

JUSTUS MURIMI: What do you mean
is how strong of a grip like

when would it like you and I
know what that means? When is a

visionary how to go Like how do
you know when the grip is too

tight?

Deacon Bradley: What does that
actually mean? It means they're

not talking about the vision,
which is like the destination,

what the thing is going to look
like, and they're getting into

the hell. So if I was just to
use an example, a CEO I was

talking to earlier today makes,
you know, like coatings for or

for things that's really vague,
but I get a vague product. And

it's usually marketed like
towards automobiles or stuff

like this. This isn't an actual
conversation, this is just an

example. And if I were to
suggest, say, hey, this thing

that we're selling, or use on
cars, we may need to be open as

part of this growth plan, we may
need to be open to using it on

phones, or I don't know, Windows
or other stuff. And I have

worked with visionaries in the
past who would shut that down.

Like, no, this is for whatever.
And that's kind of a really

specific marketing example. But
it's an example of having a

tight grip. Now, I, it's kind of
a lot to unpack here. But that's

kind of my illustration of a
tight grip. But if the vision

was around building a company
that was only for cars, and

that's the whole thing, then
yeah, shut it down. But if the

vision was just like, creating
something that makes things

shiny and clear, then you've
shut something down, then you

have to tighter grip. It's a
hard thing to explain.

JUSTUS MURIMI: No, I think I
think that's I think that's good

enough for people that would,
listening to this. And I think

it's really, really important,
because most of the time, what I

noticed is they are visionaries,
but they don't know how to date

an integrator, like they have
they think what an integrator

wants to know is a cure

Deacon Bradley: all the problems
are how do I write the job post?

Yes. Like, I'm not even going to
read the job post. Yes,

JUSTUS MURIMI: an integrator
should make you a better

visionary. Like you should feel
like challenged to think a

little bit bigger. And you
should be you should be hungry

to bring your ideas to the
integrator, because you're going

to shoot down majority of them
in a good way, because they're

looking through the holes,
because they want you to be

successful. And they're asking
you questions about because

they're actually thinking
realistically, can this happen?

Could this actually happen?

Deacon Bradley: That's a good
example. What you're bringing up

is a better example of a tight
grip versus not tight grip, if

the visionaries role is to, to
bring the vision and like bring

ideas that will bring that will
make the vision that will get

you further down the road.
That's fantastic. As an

integrator, this might be some
other perspective, you need to

hear it as a visionary as an
integrator. I'm not good at

that. So I think it's amazing
that you have all of these

ideas. Are we going to do them
all? No. But I don't have the

ideas. And I'm thrilled that
somebody is bringing me

essentially raw materials and
houseplants and I'm like, Great.

Let's build that one. Next. Yes.
And so I guess sometimes

visionaries. Like, if you're
wondering, what's my value after

somebody is doing this, that's
what it is. I don't have

anything to build without,
without the visionary.

JUSTUS MURIMI: I think that is
the best place to close it.

Because what I want is for them
to go. I just need to be more of

who I am. And think we're about
getting us to an ending point,

like a destination, and being
able to clearly depict that

destination and talk to
integrators about this

destination, and hear what their
thoughts are. pick their brain.

Deacon Bradley: Yeah, I really
love that question. You're asked

around, like, how do I approach
or attract one because I'd never

really thought about it before.
And so I was thinking back

through all of the great
conversations I've had, and the

ones where I'm still thinking
about days and weeks later, like

my wonder if there was something
there. I might go talk to this

person in every single one of
them was basically just showing

up with like, a box of stuff and
like dumping it on the desk and

BM. Like, here's my vision. Am I
missing something like what do

you see? I don't know what to do
with this, but I think you could

help. Yeah, and it wasn't like
an A proposal sort of way. It

was just like, I see your value
integrator. Yeah, what do you

see of this? And I'm like, Oh,
okay. And honestly, we have a

lot of fun doing that. Like I do
it for free with CEOs right now

just because it's fun.

JUSTUS MURIMI: Yeah. Yeah. If
If, if a visionary is listening

to this, and is going I have all
this. You know, What do I like?

How, where do integrators hang
out? Let's end on this one.

Yeah, that's, that's, I think
this will be helpful because I

think there are some that are
like, that's me. I'm right,

where they're talking about.
Okay. Where are you guys?

Deacon Bradley: That's a great
question. And I wish I could

send you to a website or a club
or something. I can't, what I

want, I'm just thinking out
loud, just as you have opened my

eyes to the value of just
talking to people in your own

network. And it's been, since
I've taken that seriously, it

has been unbelievable, the flood
of opportunities and people in

relationships that have opened
up to me. So I think the the

best place to start isn't
necessarily by looking at like

integrators Comm. I don't know
if that's a real website, take

whatever's there, I claim No,
no. If it Yeah, if it's bad, I

sorry, I sent you there. It's
not like, You're, you're going

to this website, but I kind of
see it as when you talk about

what is the job of the
visionary, it's, well, you have

the vision, and you evangelize
the vision. And you're just

talking to people about it all
the time. And if you're in if at

the end of that thing, while
you're networking and doing your

your vision CEO thing, you're
like, oh, and where I'm stuck is

I could really use a number to
to help me pull this together,

because it could go even faster.
That's, I think, a good place to

find them. Because I think a lot
of the good integrators are in

other people's businesses, or
they're consulting or they're,

yeah, friends of people. But a
lot of CEOs are going to know

them just from being in that
world, where I wouldn't find

them as like, in a Facebook
group, asking for an integrator,

right, right.

JUSTUS MURIMI: is a great way to
tap into your network. Great way

to do that. Ask if you know a
CEO who has a great integrator,

doing an honoring way, but
integrators tend to know other

integrators. And so just be able
to go approach them go, hey,

I've noticed you've done amazing
things for your CEO. Are there

other people like you that I
should be connected with, just

start to network, some
integrators have finished their

job at other jobs, and they're
ready for the next thing, and

you might be that person, that
they are like, I've been looking

for you. So you never know where
they are network, that should be

a huge part of what you do
anyways, as a visionary is

networking. Because new
opportunities lie in the

network. So

Unknown: that is all.

Deacon Bradley: One last place,
we got to look. And we'll close

it here. You should look inside
your own business. By the way.

Sometimes there's integrators
hanging out there that you just

haven't given them a chance or
the authority, or really just

noticed that they're capable of
something beyond their own job

description, but I know a lot of
people do find integrators from

within. It's a great place to
test it out. Try it out. Just,

you know, start tossing some
more stuff, and integrators love

to solve problems and create
clarity out of chaos. So you'll

know if you have one pretty
quick. That's so great. That is

so great. All right. Thanks,
Deacon. See you next week.

Thanks for joining us today on
the sharp business growth

podcast. This is one of my
favorite things to do and why

I've been so excited to bring
this podcast to you is because I

get to spend so much time around
CEOs and leaders of fast growth

businesses, Justice spend so
much time around them and, and

because of that, we have so many
conversations just like this and

this value, where when we're
able to take it back to the

business leaders that we worked
with. It just really opens their

eyes, and allows them to see
things from so many different

perspectives. And that's what
I'm so excited about. So we're

going to be sharing more
conversations like this. And

make sure you subscribe to the
show, your favorite podcast app,

so you never miss an episode.
Visit us at sharp business

growth.com For more resources,
make sure you're on the mailing

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kind of behind the scenes

stories about this as well. And
we'll see you next week.